[BETA 6.00] Feedbacks

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nexx
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Re: [BETA 6.00] Feedbacks

Post by nexx » Fri Nov 11, 2016 9:18 pm

Xaphan" wrote: Charms and relics have been changed as well. They drop less but completed. This reduce the inventory managment a lot and it is the goal of this change.

For secondary stats, I can"t really do much more than adding some text on skills like I did. And yeah, in the current version, might have no use for a sorceress. I have an idea I want to test and see what I can do to make all 4 stats usefull for all characters. To increase your mana, or your mana regeneration, you have to find items that do it, unlock some specialities or use some skills. But it will never go a lot higher than what you start with, as this is part of the new system I'm using that allows me to remove all cooldowns and make the game more fun on my eyes.
Good to hear! The more I play, though, the more it seems socketable items are overwhelmingly common. Since you can easily craft the chipped tier gems, I was thinking it'd be nice to have them start dropping from flawed upwards on later areas, at a lower rate. The rest of them like runes and class runes seem good, it'd be pretty annoying to have specific things like those be much rarer than they currently are, too.

Another thing I wanted to bring up are the salvage kits used to turn gear into crafting components. I think they're a good idea but to me it'd make more sense if the recipe didn't consume the salvage kit (or just generated another one as the resulting recipe), since the price is quite low and it basically just means you have to carry a ton of them instead of just carrying one on your cube to turn random rares into crafting mats.

Last thing I forgot to mention on the other post, I can't get storage scrolls to work. I'm not sure if I'm doing anything wrong but clicking them plays the sfx without anything happening.

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Xaphan
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Re: [BETA 6.00] Feedbacks

Post by Xaphan » Sat Nov 12, 2016 12:54 am

nexx" wrote:Good to hear! The more I play, though, the more it seems socketable items are overwhelmingly common. Since you can easily craft the chipped tier gems, I was thinking it'd be nice to have them start dropping from flawed upwards on later areas, at a lower rate. The rest of them like runes and class runes seem good, it'd be pretty annoying to have specific things like those be much rarer than they currently are, too.

Another thing I wanted to bring up are the salvage kits used to turn gear into crafting components. I think they're a good idea but to me it'd make more sense if the recipe didn't consume the salvage kit (or just generated another one as the resulting recipe), since the price is quite low and it basically just means you have to carry a ton of them instead of just carrying one on your cube to turn random rares into crafting mats.

Last thing I forgot to mention on the other post, I can't get storage scrolls to work. I'm not sure if I'm doing anything wrong but clicking them plays the sfx without anything happening.
Salvage kits are like that because at the time I created thems, there was already so much cube recipes that adding more was too much work and would slow down everything and greatly increase loading times. However,, I've reworked many things since then and reconsidering the way salvage kits work now is probably something I can do. I could increase the cost a bit and do something like "each kit can be used 20 times before it break". I will considere this.

Storage scrolls are desactivaed (and will probably be removed completely), so it is normal that they do not work.

chaoulv89
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Re: [BETA 6.00] Feedbacks

Post by chaoulv89 » Sun Nov 13, 2016 12:21 am

hey! trying new beta, and so far, its def too easy, i think damage upgrade needs to be more gradual and enemies a bit tougher, maybe with some really unique abilites, summoners, etc, curse enemies. mostly i think its skills ramp up too quickly and do too much damage for early on, but ill see as i get farther into the game, since i'm playing +8 and just one-shotting, and my skills are all over since i'm exploring them. but you'll get to that when your ready i'm sure!


as for skills, i'm trying the new necro, and i'm sad to see the morph tree gone! :cry: the skeleton morph was perfect for a under explored aspect of necromancy, and i would like to see it return as a lich. more necromancer-like and maybe be a more offense caster tree, maybe centered around ice and slow, with weaknesses to the necromancer natively, like physical weakness and fire, but more for ice and magic,death and decay style auras etc. in lich mode, but spell damage buffs! so far, the demon tree just feels like a slight alteration to the death tree, where death should be mostly summons!it feels like, well somewhat pointless, and not like an actual extra tree, plus, its not very fitting. vampire is a bit odd, but lich fits necro perfectly and is a rarely explored side of the necromancer! it may be too late to revert and alter, but just some thoughts! :)


level design so far, and revamp on start is fantastic, the towns are such an incredible addition, and adds such a depth to the world, brilliant work there ;) . weird glitch not sure what causes it, but in wet cave, i had to restart 3 times, cause i consistently had 2 enemies left, but couldn't find them after many walkthroughs of the cave, so it was a bit funky there.

JeyP
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Re: [BETA 6.00] Feedbacks

Post by JeyP » Tue Nov 15, 2016 4:23 pm

"What's comming next ?" was great! Would be nice to have some update at least one in a month or what change in new release especially there is already a new build with playable ritualist and i'm curious what changed from this beta. (any way to become closed beta tester ^^) Back to feedback:

- drop rate: it's normal difficulty so it should be easy to drop low level items but after 2 acts i have 23 set pieces and 8 uniques (even rares should not be so easy to drop, we have crafting and orbs), hope that "end game" staff will be hard to get like in vanila D2

- orb of personalization, transmutation, alteration : description says "usable on items with a requiered (typo) level equal 15 maximum" and we have new items tier every 7 levels (2, 9, 16) so it could be confusing in the beggining, why don't write simply "Usable on items level 2 and 9" or something similar, same for other orb types major, supperior, epic

- orb of destruction and protection: should have level usage like other orbs, we could take best orb enchance white item then made runeword, well right now damage on weapon do nothing so enchanced damage to but that item could be pawerfull oterwise

- page of blacksmithing (or something like that): why are no longer in the game? even with sets and uniques i crafted a lot rares with needed attributes, they probably would be obsolete on higher difficulties but its allways nice to have more choices

- set recipes: can stay after crafing on first difficulty (it's help gather low level sets that are rarely used becouse it's hard to drop all set piece before leveling up to much), on higher difficulties they should disappear on crafting

- shared money: it's should be allow to transfer money from one char to another (mostly for gambling low level items) especialy when we can't increase money drop rate

- runic scrolls: don't want to add useless cube recipes but would be nice to reveal what they actually do, don't want to look on web page what every runeword do, maybe runemaster npc that tell us about runes and scrolls and what they do, don't think that is possible but would be nice if he could reveal rune properties (something like imbue items by charsi, we put a scroll and he show it properties) well it can allways be a cube recipe

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bleedingapathy
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Re: [BETA 6.00] Feedbacks

Post by bleedingapathy » Tue Nov 15, 2016 4:58 pm

most of the stuff you are writing about is going to have a complete overhaul so what you see right now is prior 5.0 down. rune words are going to have a overhaul as well so I wouldnt really mess with them atm. I wouldnt worry about shared money as you gain levels you'll have more money than you will know what to do with, on your rich character you can gamble and get items for you other toons.

JeyP
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Re: [BETA 6.00] Feedbacks

Post by JeyP » Tue Nov 15, 2016 7:27 pm

All the time something is changing but this thread is about beta 6.00 and i wrote about beta 6.00 (latest public release) mostly to show my interest and support not to criticize. Beside even i'm not worry about this modification becouse a) autor do what he want to do even if i complain and b) he show that he have clear vision and knows what he wants to do with this modification so i don't have reasons to complain but that doesn't mean that i should not write about staff that would like to see in the game in this feedback thread. About shared money. I have always supported the idea that better have two options then one. Don't want to use it then don't do it but if someone want he can't when its not there. Beside plugy already allow that option so it's not a big deal and i want gamble my low level char for low level item and not my high level char for high level items.

nexx
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Re: [BETA 6.00] Feedbacks

Post by nexx » Tue Nov 15, 2016 9:06 pm

You can't actually turn on gold sharing in the current version, I believe.
I was looking at the plugy.ini to turn off maps regenerating every time since it makes exploration feel a bit pointless with these huge maps (you also can't change this here as I found out :P), I noticed gold sharing was off so I turned it on, but the game then gives an error about a missing button on startup.

JeyP
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Re: [BETA 6.00] Feedbacks

Post by JeyP » Wed Nov 16, 2016 4:09 pm

nexx" wrote:You can't actually turn on gold sharing in the current version, I believe.
I was looking at the plugy.ini to turn off maps regenerating every time since it makes exploration feel a bit pointless with these huge maps (you also can't change this here as I found out :P), I noticed gold sharing was off so I turned it on, but the game then gives an error about a missing button on startup.
Stash overlay has changed so "shared money" buttons need to be properly positioned to not interfere with page change buttons.

Classes:

When i first time played this mod, classes was the thing that i didn't like the most. They were just a bunch of randome skills witch class name sticker attached to them. Now classes feel much better even witch less numbers of skills well... beside warrior he totally suck. We have two masteries that each are build to stand alone on its own, so there are skills witch two damage type, minion, buff and debuff. So basically there is no main mastery that define your character. You just chose mastery throught skill that you want to use then put some points in summon/buff and then you put points in second mastery to grab summons or buff from there. Right now its better to put skill points all ower the places than to stick to one mastery only, so i would like to see some improvement to the character builds witch only one mastery. Easiest way to do this is through mastery level. They already give some minor bonuses to attributes and 10% damage and minion bonus to skill from this mastery but that is not enough. The greater lvl your character has, the less it pays to invest skill points in mastery, it's should be opposite. Maybe each mastery level increase bonus for attribute from this mastery for 1%. My little brain can't comprehend and calculate all odds to find a proper bonuse thad would be balanced so this should be tested in the game.

PVP ? Auto aim ?

Believe it or not but alot of people like PVP in D2 or it's a nice break from grinding when you play with friends. You should bare in maind this or even take advantage of it. So no auto aim skills because they would be annoying and no skill needed to use in PVP. Ofc this personal preference but i was borred after two acts witch my Frost Strafe Huntress, just press right button and thats it, no gameplay involved. Next nice step would be to make a few PVP arenas witch obstacles that block aoe skils. Something like maps from act bosses that you could go throught portal.

Attributtes and damage bonus.

Once again i have problem witch attributes and damage bonus. I'm a fan of hybrids and weirds builds so it's a little disappointing that sorceress and necro don't have mele skills but still have hope that is possible to build mele character from tem through high ias and proc skills. Anyway... What energy do? I thought that it increase elemental and magic damage ? Maybe it's a skill fault. Basically i wanted to made a dual wand burning tornado warrior but energy and wands don't increase fire damage from burning tornado skill.

qndel
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Re: [BETA 6.00] Feedbacks

Post by qndel » Wed Nov 16, 2016 7:54 pm

Would be cool if there was some kind of a tooltip on the Vitality/Intelligence/Wisdom/Might stats saying what they do :)
If you are going to make skill/stats reset possible in the normal version, would be cool if you could allow to reset specialities as well, I've clicked accidentally on fire and now I'm doomed :D
Last edited by qndel on Thu Nov 17, 2016 7:22 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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Xaphan
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Re: [BETA 6.00] Feedbacks

Post by Xaphan » Wed Nov 16, 2016 11:33 pm

Yup, but not possible as of now unfortunately.

nexx
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Re: [BETA 6.00] Feedbacks

Post by nexx » Thu Nov 17, 2016 3:13 pm

Been playing a warrior for a little bit, I tried the melee skills and ended up using wave of fire as main attack, since many others require to directly click monsters and that gets too wonky for me when dealing with huge crowds :P.
The skill itself is fun to use, but after a bit I noticed it doesn't seem to actually have a melee component. As in, the swing doesn't seem to actually hit and instead just casts the projectile forward. I didn't care much about it until I noticed that to a degree this happens with all melee skills, and even those who do hit with the weapon, do so for the initial strike and then proc a skill off it that no longer seems to use it.
This is a pretty big problem I think, because it makes it so in practice melee skills don't actually use the weapon for most of their effects. Even stats gotten from the weapons themselves and build-related specialties are rendered useless, such as deadly/crushing blow, life leech, any kind of "on hit" proc, or even flat damage bonuses.

To me that sort of kills the differentiation between ranged/melee and spells, because the options that are made available by actually using the weapon as a main component on skills are lost, and you end up with a "caster" who uses different main stats, and whose damage and functionality is pretty much determined by the skills alone.
I'm not sure if this has been brought up before, but I felt it was important to mention because I've always thought weapon builds are much open to imaginative setups, since you effectively change how a skill "works" when you change your weapon's secondary effects, with "on hit" procs or otherwise.

All this said I was quite surprised by how the warrior skills played out, on paper they sounded pretty similar yet when actually using them the differentiation was notable. Just little things like poison having a ranged attack, a main aoe skill and then a crowd control that pushes things around were really neat. It's quite awkward they don't auto-swing when you run into something using the rmb though, it made it pretty difficult for me to use them with the current enemy density :D.

nexx
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Re: [BETA 6.00] Feedbacks

Post by nexx » Thu Dec 01, 2016 3:24 pm

Just a few things I'd wanna add to the above post since I beat normal a few days ago:

The difficulty curve is actually kind of neat. I still stand by the monster changes you've mentioned before, but the damage is definitely on the right direction going from a3 upwards. At that point it really mattered getting caught by strong melee enemies because the damage they did wasn't trivial anymore. That said I don't think there's any need to make a1/2 as little punishing as they are, in part because currently there's only one difficulty and it feels like the challenging part of the game is too short.
Regarding act length. I'm playing through as a necro now and although a1 seems alright, I think some a2 areas are really too gigantic. To the point monsters stop being fun to fight (or worth it exp-wise) and I just teleport through the main deserts. I understand this may change as you add new map features but a2 is the one act I'd say has too large areas.
I recorded this video for a friend, it was the first time I was doing that part of the game and the previous realms had actually been fairly challenging for the build. The -cold res realm boss for example took a few tries to get right. However the prime evils in this last part of the game just got wrecked in the same player settings. Mephisto himself wasn't very hard in a3, but I the fight against diablo in a4 was actually pretty tricky, so I was definitely surprised to see them go down so fast.

A few random things I noticed:
There is no way to test the sets and uniques in the beta, but I think their drop rate is pretty good. Early on you have a lot which probably helps with weaker or slower builds, and in later acts they become less common and more special to find. I only got one level 74 unique for example, and a handful of 71s.
Related to this, crafting probably could be made less click intensive. It works for making normals, sets and uniques, since the results are fixed and you don't make so many, but I think rares need a much faster system that lets you reroll quicker. Eventually I just disregarded crafting and used the orbs of alteration since they're much less tedious.*
Also related, many times the recipe to make normal items with X sockets will produce different numbers of sockets (or even magical/rare items).
Shanka's rare amulet reward was level 9 even though my character was 75.
Azmodan's minions in the realm of sin died pretty much instantly both times I did it (p8). Not sure what the trick was there but they died really fast.
Uniques with the aura that gives -cast speed can actually make you unable to cast at all if it goes negative enough. I thought this was pretty cool but not sure if intended :P.
Monsters could use having higher aggro ranges to fit the new resolution, else with some skills you can always blow them up before they can react.
After playing a2 with a hell orb necro I take back what I said about monsters with hit procs :D. I love that they're so distinctly dangerous for multihits but you hit sprite limit way more easily than I thought.

*I actually ended the game with a sword I crafted at level ~50 because it had great rolls for wave of fire; level 74 ones had 4x the damage but due to the way melee skills work in the beta this damage isn't used for the actual skill, and I couldn't bear to do the crafting click dance anymore :D

That's all! All the three characters I played were very enjoyable and pretty different, definitely looking forward to the new version.

Rayzem
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Re: [BETA 6.00] Feedbacks

Post by Rayzem » Sun Dec 25, 2016 11:23 am

Amazing mod, I really like the changes to Necromancer, summons and skills are really cool, not so much Warrior, he no longer looks like a melee class, the general warrior archetype but rather a caster, I like some of the skills but I really think warrior/barbarian needs some of the good old skills back but in an improved version and I have 2 suggestions :
1.A stronger version of Frenzy + some splash damage ( splash passive damage bonus to get it on par with the other skills and make good use of the weapon skills which lately seem not make a huge difference like they should )
2.Whirlwind seems way weaker then other skill barbarian has right now, also if you have played Path of Exile you know how Vaal Whirlwind works, Vaal whirlwind drags all monsters nearby inside, and the passive part can be to increase the radius of it. (becoming the meatgrinder a warrior should really be)

I also see some familiar items from Titan's Quest and Orb of Alteration from path of Exile, I like that you inspired from those games but I don't think copying the exact same name and the same aspect is a good idea, I like what you did with the game, I don't like copying other things from the games without changing their aspect, names (Titan Quest items, POE Int, Strength, Dex interface etc...) into original ones. The other Orbs and items are fine. Great job with them !

About monsters strength I suggest you take a look at another mod for Diablo 2. It's an old one but it's crazy good due to monsters types, strengths, loot and crafting as well, an old mod that was amazing in terms of balance and had one of the best crafting I have ever seen: Ancients: The Fury Within. Monsters were hard to very hard in Hell difficulty, but crafting was very strong and it balanced it out extremly well. Knowing what to craft made a big difference against monsters. Crafting system is good in Royaume des Ombres, I enjoy the system. It can be further improved if you take a look at the old mod I suggest, you'll definitely understand why.

Anyway, amazing work man! It's one of the best Diablo 2 mods out there, we can see the huge amount of work you dedicated to it, keep up the good work and improve it even further!
Merry Christmas ! :D

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